Heroes, Community & CCL Esports
My Builds My Tiers
Response to the recent reddit thread on Pro Players/Streamers being toxic
Okay, I know that there definitely is merit to what prompted this recent Reddit thread calling out HGC players/streamers being toxic, but reading some of these comments, actually super disappoints me. It seems like half of these comments are just being extremely toxic towards the HGC pro players in general.

Comments such as "Give the pro's a break guys, it is the only thing that makes them seem not worthless in this world, and it only lasts for a few years for them". Obviously this is just one example, but there are numerous comments like this. I think it's perfectly fine and even encouraged to speak out about toxicity because I personally would love to live in a world, and a Heroes Esports community that isn't toxic and inspires each other, but there are many lines that I think are being crossed.

I look at this thread and It looks like fighting toxicity with more toxicity, and I really don't think that's the answer. I am by no means saying no pro players have been toxic, and I'm not trying to defend any toxicity, however I think that this deserves to be a conversation rather than a pointing fingers argument.

I guess I kind of feel the need to rant about this for a couple reasons: 

1. Because I try pretty hard to be a positive influence on people and the Heroes of the Storm scene in general, and I guess threads like this feel like what I try to do is being overlooked or ignored? Which I logically know is not the case, I know there are people who appreciate and support, but It feels like fighting against something I'm supposed to be working with instead.

2. I think in no way is it ever correct to fight toxicity with toxicity.

I guess overall I just feel shitty that something that i'm so so passionate about and am dedicating my life to is just being shit on by so many people, because maybe they think all/most pro players are like that or something. Maybe I'm letting this bug me more than it should, but I just wanted to start this conversation and shed some light to how I feel about the situation.

I just hope that people could be decent individuals to one another.
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I think one thing that people often forget about you guys (by that I mean HGC players), you guys are people too, I think we as humans have a tendency to put people on a alter and try to say things like "these guys are pros they shouldn't be doing blah blah". While I do agree that it sucks that some HGC players do display more toxic patterns, I don't think its intentional, a lot of times cause they get frustrated and mad at a video game like any other person would. But I do think that the community can do its part by just pointing it out rather than just coming at players with more toxic behavior.

I feel like part of this behavior is rooted to the fact that, well if we think about it, games like these its really easy to develop an ego and as a viewer its easy to be having this god's eye like view and judge people (we see this with people that watch sports like the super bowl all the time).

Last thing I want to add, even though I can't tune into your streams often or catch every match this team performs in, do know players like myself do appreciate what you and your team contributes to this community and respect the passion you guys have for this game.
Khroen It's hard for me to comment on topics like this, because I'm insanely toxic myself as soon as people start pissing me off... But reading this post of you made me genuinely feel bad for you (and some others).

Please don't feel like what you do is "pointless" or ignored/not appreciated by people. You have always been a stand-out personality in the scene with your approach to things. I might not always agree with your always positive way of handling people, but you have my full respect for trying, and I know how much hard work you put into making the game and community you love a better one. And I'm 100% sure that all but a few people feel the same way about you.

The topic itself is almost impossible to solve. There's two kinds of toxicity... One group are people who are legit toxic in the full meaning of the word. The other group are people who share your levels of passion for the game but show it in other ways, and get angry or disappointed when people don't perform the way you'd expect them to (on a certain rank, etc.). Yet humanity always has been, and always will be, ego-based. The majority of people who RIGHTFULLY get called out for their fuckups ingame, will never admit and accept that, and rather look to shift the blame away from them by calling people toxic...

None of this matters in the end, as I just want you to know that no matter how many people are legit toxic, and no matter how many people use toxicity as a cheap excuse... YOU (and a few select others) are always the one that has been true to himself, and you'd have to dig really deep to find someone who doesn't love and respect you for what you do.

Please don't feel discouraged, and stay the way you are man, we love you for it
sorry, what I forgot to add about the toxicity topic: The reason why the situation is impossible to solve is because the line between the two types of (aleged) toxicity is so thin, you can in most cases not even tell one from the other...
I think at times, people feel a sort of "barrier" between pros/streamers and regular players, which has often been enforced by some rather toxic treatment of those regular players on stream or otherwise. Sometimes it's hard to remember that both sides are people and they both have feelings that can get hurt when the other side is being toxic to them.

For what it's worth, when I've tuned in to your streams, I've always been very pleased with how relaxed you are and how much you avoid the toxicity that often overwhelms other streamers. Keep doing what you're doing. :)
I wouldn't take it personally. Watching your steam regularly, i don't recall you being toxic about any other players even though sometimes we can clearly see how much a teammate is under-performing.

Keep up your good work!
I think in general people forget or maybe are completely unaware of the impact their words and actions can have on other people. A little bit of effort to be a positive influence, even in the most seemingly insignificant Hero League game, could have an effect on someone else, who then has an effect on the next person and so on.

If we can change our frame of mind when it comes to what traditionally frustrates people in Heroes, we can make the community at large a more welcoming environment.

Keep doing what you do, Khroen. We're a better community for it.
McIntyre Khroen I hope you guys know that on the whole people really enjoy your streams. A lot of this discussion is simply spawned from the frustrations around HL right now and people are venting. Some people are really bad at venting and become toxic and think their toxicity is ok because others are doing it too. Like Halorin said, people don't realize the impact their words have. Keep doing what you guys do!
Getting frustrated is one thing. Venting is one thing.

Acting unprofessionally is another.

I honestly think it's a handful of people, but I have seen a few really toxic and condescending streamers / pro players. I honestly wanted to say about it, but I didn't think it'd do anything but make enemies. So I simply left the channel(s) and never went back. But to be disparaging the people who pay your bills... Because, yup, it's those lowly gold and silver players who actually pay for 90% of Heroes of Storm and who make being an esports pro or full time streamer possible. Certain pros need to be reminded of this fact....

But, anyhooooo...

It really does come down to professionalism. If you think of that way, if you realise that you're a person who makes a living from playing Heroes of the Storm, then it's EXACTLY about acting professionally on the job.